Barry Beckham Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 IgorDo you think this issue needs addressing at some stage. I can't quite understand why the default playback of a sequence has to expand the images to fit the monitor the show is being played on. Surely if a person makes a show at 1024*680 the images should display at that size on any monitor it is being played on as a default. I see lots of slide shows, many from this forum, where the author is unaware that those running a higher resolution monitor are seeing their images enlarged to the degree that image quality is not good.Shouldn't the default be the other way round, always display the show at the resolution of the images unless the author ticks a box to say different. i.e "expand show to fit monitor". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gérard de Lux Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 Shouldn't the default be the other way round, always display the show at the resolution of the images unless the author ticks a box to say different. i.e "expand show to fit monitor".I agree and second this opinion! The two French forums (mine and JPD's) were quite upset by this new default feature and the explanations given at the time for this approach (i.e. deletion of 'original mode') didn't convince us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xahu34 Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 Barry,Option "Fixed Size of Slide" should do what you want, isn't it? Of course, it is not the default setting.Regards,Xaver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Beckham Posted July 28, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 XaverYes, fixing size of slide will do the job, but that isn't the point. You know that and I know that, but the vast majority of people do not and as I said earlier, many of those people are on this forum and would consider themselves way above a basic user of PTE, but they are unaware of this issue and fall into the trap. Why should you have to tick a box (that is by no means self explanitory) to get your slide show to display as you made it? It makes no sense unless there are some programming technical issues that I am not aware of. PTE's reputation comes to some degree from the image quality, it should not be via some secret setting that is known only by a chosen few enthusiasts.All I am saying is that from where I sit, the default is round the wrong way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xahu34 Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 Barry,I don't think that life is that easy. Consider the situation of a simple Ken Burns show. All images should have a size of 1500x1000. Each image should have individual animation parameters (slight, screen filling pans and zooms, maybe also rotations). Which screen resolution should PTE choose, if it were asked to do this automatically on a screen of size 1600x1200?Regards,Xaver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davegee Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 Barry,I'm not sure that I totally agree with what you are saying but I certainly understand where you are "coming from". This was discussed at great length when we lost “Original Mode”.I have been advocating for years that it would be good practice on the part of the author to indicate at the beginning of a show the OPTIMUM resolution for viewing. This can be done utilising the start up screen. If it is overwhelmingly important that upsizing does not occur then Window Mode is still available in addition to Xaver’s suggestion. The programme has been made increasingly complex over the last couple of years, partly due to the demands made on Igor by individuals for features that, in some cases it would seem, would only apply to those individuals. But rather than change too much I would like to see better documentation created from a USER’s point of view. Rather than just explaining what each feature does it needs to demonstrate how a feature can be used.For instance, “If you want to maintain the same image size on screen on a variety of different resolution monitors this is what you do…….”The answer for me is to create shows at 1920x1080 (or 1920x1200) so that the show will be downsized on more occasions than it is likely to be upsized (I realise that there are higher resolution monitors out there). This makes the Project File Size high but it has not created big problems yet.There seems to be a reluctance on the part of MANY photographers to move up from 1024x768 and a lot of these photographers already have LCD monitors which have an even higher native resolution. I keep hearing that on anything other than 1024x768 "the icons are too small"!DaveG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Cox Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 IMHOusing the high resolutions can hide many sins ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davegee Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 Ken,I'm not sure if that means that you are in favour of using the high resolutions or against it?Using the native resolution of YOUR OWN monitor seems to me to be the only answer.DaveG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Cox Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 NO I dont run the native resoution - i have to respect my eyes - i run 1024/76819" SAMSUNG 932BMax Resolution 1280 x 1024 / 75.0 Hz will have to get a bigger monitor to run higher resor use the 37" tv NOTken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemjr Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 Barry, I agree with you totally. I have been using PTE almost since it was first developed. I am not an expert and at my age do not remember all the things I should. I was not aware of the "Fixed Size of Slide" option. Maybe Igor will re-think this decision.Howard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xahu34 Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 ... I was not aware of the "Fixed Size of Slide" option. Maybe Igor will re-think this decision...Howard,It is not clear to me what you really mean. Can you explain in more detail in which way the re-thinking should happen.Best regards,Xaver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemjr Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 Xaver, sorry I was not clear. I was agreeing with Barry's statement "Shouldn't the default be the other way round, always display the show at the resolution of the images unless the author ticks a box to say different. i.e "expand show to fit monitor". Howard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Beckham Posted July 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 I don't think that life is that easy. Consider the situation of a simple Ken Burns show. All images should have a size of 1500x1000. Each image should have individual animation parameters (slight, screen filling pans and zooms, maybe also rotations). Which screen resolution should PTE choose, if it were asked to do this automatically on a screen of size 1600x1200?I don't see why not, any animation still needs to be kept inside the overall resolution for the slide show, whatever that is. I don't see how any animation impacts on what I am saying at all.DaveGYour idea is no good either, when I suggested a monitor be changed in resolution to see a slide show at its best, I recall reedback from this very forum that was very hostile. You would think I had asked people to have a limb amputated. Forgive me for saying this, but your missing the point. You know the solution to this and so do I, but experts are not the purpose of this post. It shouldn't be almost a secret handshake that is needed to have a show play perfectly.Perhaps we are some of the cause of a reluctance to change resolutions, particulalry when making shows. There was a time when it was daft to create anything bigger than 1024*768 as the poower to run the show was often not there. We drummed into people they must make their showe at or within these resolutions and some I feel have got that cemented in their brain. We have moved on so far that those sizes are no longer the case. Like you I make shows large because one the most positive things about PTE is that it plays the shows on a smaller res monitors great, so I have the best of all worlds.KenI havn't a clue what you mean about high res hiding sins, please can you explain? How does a low res protect your eyes. Eyes are amuscle like any in the body and when they get tired they tell you when to stop. If you mean to be able to see icons because of poor site, then that is different. However, you can use a 1024*768 screen to produce any size show you want, as you know.HowardYou have it in one, thank you for understanding what I am talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davegee Posted July 29, 2009 Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Hi Barry,I wasn't suggesting that anyone change their resolution to view a show - I would be the last to do that myself.I was suggsting that a fullscreen show made at 1920x1080 will show fullscreen on any resolution monitor. Being 1920x1080 the majority of monitors in use at this time will be smaller and therefore the re-sizing is downwards. On the few (?) occasions when such a show is viewed at a higher res the warning I suggested comes into play telling the viewer that the quality of the show COULD be compromised.I'm sorry to keep bringing up the use of LCD monitors at anything other than full native resolution. I just think that it is stupid unless the user has a vision problem.We are covering old ground here.DaveG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Beckham Posted July 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 DaveGSorry, I misunderstood, but it still doesn't help as what newcomer is going to think about creating a slide show at 1920*1200/1920*1080 if their monitor runs at 1024*768People at their Camera Club, if they are members, will all be saying create the show at 1024*768. Even throwing 1024*680 into the pot to retain format is enough for many to lose it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Cox Posted July 29, 2009 Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Barry asked"KenI havn't a clue what you mean about high res hiding sins, please can you explain? How does a low res protect your eyes. Eyes are amuscle like any in the body and when they get tired they tell you when to stop. If you mean to be able to see icons because of poor site, then that is different. However, you can use a 1024*768 screen to produce any size show you want, as you know."with hi res the images on the screen are smaller -- text spreadsheets picts etc therefore flaws in picts etc are not easily seen - and my eyes strain too much to see -- we have this discussion many times when you recommend we change the screen resolution to what you want - as it is your shows generally do not fill my screen because i refuse to change my res to suit youanother example letters written on laptops - the text default is small and i can hardly read it comfortablyken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Beckham Posted July 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Kenwe have this discussion many times when you recommend we change the screen resolution to what you want - as it is your shows generally do not fill my screen because i refuse to change my res to suit you.Well, firstly the request was as much to suit you ( and others) as well as me. I assumed that as a PTE enthusiast you (and others) would want to see top quality images, it seems some don't seem to care or appreciate what they are looking at. How many times do we say there are but two parts of AV and they both need to be spot on.Anyway, you don't have to change your resolution any more. Now that PTE has put right that annoying problem of a show made at one resolution looking awful on another, you don't have to worry.I am with DaveG on this, that probably the best course of action these days is to create your show at 1920*1200 or 1920*1080 no matter what screen you are using.Why?1. Because when and if you ever move up to a larger screen, your slide show will look superb and not small in the middle of that large screen. (not the be all and end all, but worth considering)2. The slide show will play fine on a 1024*768/1280*1024 monitors too, the only issue is a thin black band top and bottom and a thin line around the images tends to make that less obtrusive anyway.I appreciate that if you have issues with site, you need a biger icon, but the trend is towards larger screens.All this doesn't alter the fact the a new user of PTE puts a show together that looks great on their monitor (1024*768) and looks awful on mine and many others. If you don't want to reach a larger audience it doesn't matter a hoot, but if that show is put up here or beachbrook, the author obviously does want to reach a wider audience or they wouldn't have posted it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xahu34 Posted July 29, 2009 Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 ... "Shouldn't the default be the other way round, always display the show at the resolution of the images unless the author ticks a box to say different. i.e "expand show to fit monitor"...Howard,Thank you for your answer. I thought that you were thinking of something of this kind. The problem here is to decide "What is the resolution of the images?". If PTE should choose the optimal size for a show automatically, this had to work in each and every case. If the user prepares his show with images of various sizes, if he uses animation (in particular zooms), and if he places several objects into his slides, it will be a rather complex decision process to find "the resolution of the images". There will be contradictory requirements within single slides, the optimal size may vary from slide to slide. I don't believe in this feature, but I agree with DaveG that a better documentation would be helpful.Regards,Xaver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Beckham Posted July 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Howard,Thank you for your answer. I thought that you were thinking of something of this kind. The problem here is to decide "What is the resolution of the images?". If PTE should choose the optimal size for a show automatically, this had to work in each and every case. If the user prepares his show with images of various sizes, if he uses animation (in particular zooms), and if he places several objects into his slides, it will be a rather complex decision process to find "the resolution of the images". There will be contradictory requirements within single slides, the optimal size may vary from slide to slide. I don't believe in this feature, but I agree with DaveG that a better documentation would be helpful.Regards,XaverXaverI don't quite understand sorry.If I make a show at 1920*1200 with animation it obviously looks good played back on a 1920*1200 screen, but when it is played on a smaller monitor that are no issues with animation that I have found at all. All the animation is retained within the format of the show. Zooms pans are all fine.I have a balloon AV made at 1920*1200 and it has some animation in it, download it and see how it looks to you on your monitor, if you have a smaller res monitor of course. On my demo PC the slide show runs perfectly OK and I even demonstrate this show via the PC projector too. That is a 1024*768 projector, but it all works fine. Link below if you want to try itIts called Forever Floating to be Freehttp://www.beckhamdigital.co.uk/freestuffdigslidesw4.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Cox Posted July 29, 2009 Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Barry a few of us have been using 1920/1080 format for quite some time -- anticipating the use of ws tv as the normken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xahu34 Posted July 29, 2009 Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 ... I don't quite understand sorry ...Barry,You say that PTE should "display the show at the resolution of the images". Look at the simple example of a slide containing two images of sizes 750x1050 and 800x1200, sitting side by side and which cover the screen. How to "display the show at the resolution of the images" in this case? Should it be 1400x1050 or 1600x1200? A decision has to be made. Should this be done by PTE or by the user himself?Best regards,Xaver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Beckham Posted July 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 xaverYou would have to select a resolution for your show in the options > screen tab and the size of the slide. But perhaps your right, there may be technical issues against this that I am over looking, it was a suggestion for Igor. However, it still doesn't change the fact that a new user of PTE will not know about this problem and may not do so some time and all the while their shows will be seen by others in poor quality because of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xahu34 Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 ... You would have to select a resolution for your show in the options > screen tab and the size of the slide. But perhaps your right, there may be technical issues against this that I am over looking ...Barry,I do not think that there are big technical issues. Having the Fixed Size mode as default would surely be helpful, regarding the problem that you have mentioned. The fact that in this case the user had to enter (or select) the resolution when starting a project, could be regarded as a pitfall for newbies, as well One might come to the conclusion that some basic knowledge is indispensable Regards,Xaver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davegee Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Now this might sound like a crazy idea, but as a compromise it might work.When you open a NEW PROJECT you always have to go to PROJECT OPTIONS to set the project up the way you want it.(The alternative to NEW PROJECT is a set of TEMPLATES ready configured).What if, when you opened a new projected, PTE forced you to make certain decisions about the screen setup?One of the decisions you might have to make is whether the project should maintain the size of the MAIN IMAGE at a fixed value for resolution and aspect ratio.ORfit to a fixed aspect ratio screen regardless of resolution.In other words instead of there being a default which suits some but does not suit others you would choose the "default".Nothing would change with regard to the project parameters, but you would be forced to make the decisions, making you think about the implications of what you are choosing.DaveG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xahu34 Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 ... What if, when you opened a new projected, PTE forced you to make certain decisions about the screen setup ...Dave,Why forcing the user? Why not to offer some kind of friendly configuration assistant Regards,Xaver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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